Thursday, September 01, 2005

And The Lord Said...

If you want an example of how out of touch from reality the far Christian right is in the United States, look no further than here. In a press release, "Repent America" claims that God sent the hurricane to New Orleans because, well...I'll let them explain it:

PHILADELPHIA - Just days before "Southern Decadence", an annual homosexual celebration attracting tens of thousands of people to the French Quarters section of New Orleans, Hurricane Katrina destroys the city.

"Southern Decadence" has a history of filling the French Quarters section of the city with drunken homosexuals engaging in sex acts in the public streets and bars. Last year, a local pastor sent video footage of sex acts being performed in front of police to the mayor, city council, and the media. City officials simply ignored the footage and continued to welcome and praise the weeklong celebration as being an "exciting event". However, Hurricane Katrina has put an end to the annual celebration of sin.

Don't these guys have anything better to do? Aren't there cartoon characters to out?

UPDATE: Apparently, God is also mad at New Orleans for all the abortions going on there.

UPDATE 2: I asked for it, and one alert reader has sent in an instance of nutty left wing groups commenting on Katrina. While their statement is less bizarre in my opinion, the group is more credible. Follow the link and see how they're helping fight the biggest problem in New Orleans today - overturned pig trucks.


  • Unfortunately, it's reality-challenged nutbars like this who think they put Bush in the White House and he owes them. Maybe that's why Bush cut funding to the levee and pumping systems of New Orleans over the last few years, making this tragedy inevitable.

    Good find.


    By Blogger Ted Betts, at 3:09 p.m.  

  • Thats funny, I've seen plenty of articles claiming that God sent the hurricane to punish George Bush for the war in Iraq. How come you didnt post those?

    Oh wait.....

    TB, just wondering how much you have donated to the victim yet, as you sure point fingers quickly.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 3:55 p.m.  

  • As a general principle, I don't talk publicly about how much I donate to charity - do you? - or how much I've contributed to the Red Cross tsunami relief fund or the Red Cross New Orleans relief fund. My wife, Red Cross and the taxman know but that's about it.
    However, I did post a link on my blog encouraging people to donate. It's hardly anything at all, and I would never claim to have ever done enough, but I have donated, I have blogged, and I volunteer in organizations that do much more than me.

    Seriously, though Anonymous, do you really want to get into an "I did more than you" pissing match? No one wins those; everyone looks bad.

    But please do tell us where we can find all of these articles claiming God sent the hurricane to punish George Bush. While I've seen some bloggers postulate so, I haven't seen any organization issue a press release or make a formal public announcement the way these folks have. I can't speak for CalgaryGrit, but you find me a press release I can link to and I promise I will post it at Cerberus. (I'll even give you a hat tip, if you tell us who you are.)


    By Blogger Ted Betts, at 5:09 p.m.  

  • Hi,
    I think that this post compels a response. I do realize you were not saying that all evangelicals believe God did this to punish New Orleans for its sins. But I would like to state categorically as a Christian that no believer in their right mind would say that God did this to punish sin.

    By Blogger Hasty, at 5:10 p.m.  

  • Lest anyone be led to think that I hold such a view, thanks Hasty, and let me concur: this is not a mainstream Christian belief and I have a feeling it isn't even very mainstream for evangelical Christians.


    By Blogger Ted Betts, at 5:40 p.m.  

  • Obviously this is a fringe group that speaks 5 or 6 of their members.

    And there are plenty of kooky left wing groups out there too. Find me a good story about one of them, and I'll gladly post it.

    By Blogger calgarygrit, at 7:13 p.m.  

  • Orleans county was the most Democrat county in the state (78% in 2004). I'm going to post about this on a different note..

    I agree that the article was out of line, but to be fair, last year when the hurricanes hit Florida, there were articles and forwards flying all over the place claiming that they hit Republican counties, and that "god was punishing them".

    It's stupid on both sides..

    By Blogger Michael Fox, at 7:31 p.m.  

  • TT: groups like these are so far out there that they don't fit on a side. I certainly wouldn't put them as an extreme example of your camp. However, in truth, I have yet to read anything like what you and Anonymous suggest, i.e. "God has smitten Republicans because they are evil". Like CG and I said above, prove us wrong and we'll post, but I'm really not sure there are those kind of religious counter-examples coming from churches or other Christian groups.


    By Blogger Ted Betts, at 7:55 p.m.  

  • Cerberus, I'll post it on my blog when I get a chance, I promise. I found the forward.

    Basically, it says that the hurricanes last year only hit republican counties in Florida, and implies that they deserved it. The text of it is as follows:

    "I thought it was an interesting coincidence that a state with questionable presidential election results would be pummeled by hurricanes just before the next election. Then I thought it was an interesting coincidence that the storms spared Miami, who voted for Gore in 2000. Just out of curiosity, I overlaid two maps: one of the tracks of the hurricanes of 2004, and one of the elections results of 2000.

    This is no longer an interesting coincidence. It is an unmistakable message from God. I hope everyone is listening."

    The premise for this was later proved to be false. I'll post that too.

    By Blogger Michael Fox, at 8:02 p.m.  

  • Oh, I'll give you that for sure. Lots and lots of wingnuts on either side who would wish disaster on each other. And I'll add that there are as many left-wing organizations that have made kooky accusations and ridiculous event links. But I haven't come across a Christian religious organization or, I think, any other religious organization (though I'm less certain about this) that has claimed God has taken direct action against the right, or the ultra-religious, or some other such leanings. I just don't think it's out there, but I'm willing to be convinced. If you find a link, post it here or e-mail it to me. You at least stuck around to work through the point; Anonymous from up above, I see, has chosen to remain anonymous on the issue.

    By the way, given your postings on various sites, I'm particularly curious about how you - and you too CG - would score on the political compass. According to my scores, I'm economically a -0.38 (almost dead centre) and socially a -5.18 (about 3/4 of the way to being libertarian).


    By Blogger Ted Betts, at 9:05 p.m.  

  • Most large, official, religious organizations wouldn't claim that god has taken direct action against the Republican party because most of those organizations (sticking to a discussion of the USA) are Republican. If that's the point you're trying to make, I wouldn't really argue with you. I'm sure if I did a Google search I could probably find a "religious organization" that made a comment like that at some point. By and large, I think I agree with the point you're trying to make, so I'll let someone else who wishes to debate it do the Google search. :)

    As for the political compass test, my score seems to change every time I take it - I'm not sure if that shows openmindedness or lak of conviction - I think people would attach a different label to it depending on whether they agree or disagree with me on the issue of the day. :)

    My most recent result is posted here. Generally, I'm a plus on the economic side (free market), and a minus on the social scale. Overall, probably Libertarian/Classical Liberal.

    You'll also be interested in my results on the "Libertarian test", which I posted here.

    Toronto Tory

    By Blogger Michael Fox, at 9:50 p.m.  

  • No, I'm not trying to be even that narrow. Any religious organization that has come out and said that some/any natural disaster or human tragedy is an example of God's wrath in action against a conservative group/culture. I'll post it if you can find it, but I just don't think it's out there.

    (And by the way, you are perpetuating a false myth out there to say that most Christian groups are Republicans. Most are probably non-partisan and, yes, most fundamentalist or evangelical are probably Republican and, yes, the most vocal are probably Republican; but it is completely wrong to say that most Christian groups or religious organizations generally are conservative, let alone Republican. Capital punishment, welfare state, environment, AIDS, African aid... these types of issues have led many to the other side. Canada's welfare system in fact was founded by Christian evangelism. But we'll leave this thread for another post perhaps.)


    By Blogger Ted Betts, at 10:13 a.m.  

  • Cerberus.. I really don't follow you.

    The point should be whether there are *people* on both sides that would say such silly things about god punishing one group or another.

    Whether they are part of some official religious group is not relevant.

    I really don't understand why you're hammering away on this.

    To rehash you said:

    But I haven't come across a Christian religious organization or, I think, any other religious organization (though I'm less certain about this) that has claimed God has taken direct action against the right

    So what? I really don't see how this is profound.

    By Blogger Michael Fox, at 6:41 p.m.  

  • Another thought, just to be clear, because I think there's a miscommunication here:

    You said:I have yet to read anything like what you and Anonymous suggest

    I say - don't lump us together. We are distinct people with distinct points. If you wish to debate me, debate me on my precise statements. I will not allow you to attribute the comments of others to me.

    You said:I'm really not sure there are those kind of religious counter-examples coming from churches or other Christian groups.

    I respond - I never said there were those kind of counter-examples coming from churches or other Christian groups. I did make a comment on content that was flying around the internet around the time of the hurricanes in 2004. I made NO comment on the source of that content.

    By Blogger Michael Fox, at 7:09 p.m.  

  • Calgary Grit, you wanted some stories about left wing Christians being whacked out. Try writing about any Christian who still supports the Liberal Party with all the corruption that came out during the Gomery Inquiry. How any Canadian let alone Christian can still support such a corrupt regime far surpasses the nonsense of right wingers seeing H. Katrina as God's wrath on N.O.

    There you are.
    Let her rip

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:00 p.m.  

  • Maybe that's why Bush cut funding to the levee and pumping systems of New Orleans over the last few years, making this tragedy inevitable.

    Why is it the responsibility of someone in Seatle to pay for the levee system in New Orleans? Bush has also increased aid to Africa by 300% compared to Clinton.

    When Paul Martin cut transfers to the provinces in the mid-nineties were you pointing out that Martin was responsible for the thousands of people who invariably died because of poorer health care???

    People like you blow my mind.

    By Blogger ferrethouse, at 10:52 p.m.  

  • Interesting post here Mr. Grit. My apologies, but I think you need to be a little bit more intellectually fair to this group you call "the far Christian right." What is the difference between the Christian right and the far Christian right? And your post seems to implicate ALL on the "far" Christian right (after all, you say: " If you want an example of how out of touch from reality the far Christian right is in the United States ...") and later you write: " Obviously this is a fringe group that speaks 5 or 6 of their members." So which is it? Or are there only 5 or 6 in what you call the "far" Christian right?

    I agree that this hurricane cannot with any certainty be understood as punishment for the sin of New Orleans. But my question is - on what basis do you make this assessment? By what standard do you make this judgment? Upon what premises do you draw this conclusion, and how in turn do you also suppost those premises? In other words - how do you know that this wasn't the punishment of God?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 4:36 p.m.  

  • Might I suggest that the Christian bashers grow up a bit, and the religious whack jobs turn off the TV and actually read your Bible instead of using it as a thumping stick for a change. To those of you who bash conservative Christians, you cannot have things both ways. What I mean is that the liberal and middle ground groups tell the Christian right that we are incorrect in condemning all of Islam because of the actions of a few, yet the left has no problem demonizing Christians based on the statements made by a few.

    I am a conservative Christian. I do not believe that all Muslims are terrorists likewise I do not believe that God is punishing New Orleans. The very idea is ludicrous. God is our father. He created all of us in his image and I wonder what earthly father would punish his child with death for their transgressions. Do not get me wrong, I am not one of those people who believe that there are many paths to Heaven, I believe in one way, Jesus Christ.

    To my fellow conservative Christians, like I eluded to earlier, stop taking as gospel the words of power hungry, deluded, and flawed men and test what they have to say against scripture. The Bible compares God to a loving father, so again I wonder what loving father punishes his child with death.

    I have a serious question? Why is it, in our culture, whenever something tragic occurs, our knee jerk reaction is to locate the person, persons, entity, etc… that we feel are responsible and heap as much condemnation there upon as is humanly possible.

    Homosexuals in New Orleans did not cause God to send his wrath in the form of a hurricane to obliterate the gulf region. The same is true for those that practice voodoo, wicca, witchcraft, santeria, etc… Sin did not cause the hurricane and God did not send Katrina to punish his children.

    George Bush did not cause Katrina and did not cause the devastation created by Katrina. The funding cuts to the levees may or may not have contributed, but I think that nature has proven again and again that no matter how much technology we throw at her, we are still no match for mother nature in the end. I don’t care how much money our government could have pumped into New Orleans (pardon the pun) in the long run it does not matter, Katrina was a tragedy waiting to happen.

    If you need to blame someone blame the morons who decided it would be a smart idea to build a city below sea level in the gulf!

    It seems as a society that we place so much more effort in placing blame (too often to push some political or religious agenda) than we expend on actually helping. Do we as a culture feel so utterly helpless that instead of doing something useful, we would just as soon point fingers, whine, bitch and sit back on our bloated self-righteous buttocks? I think the reason is that if we ever stopped looking for a face onto which we can attach blame, we might actually have to (OMG) DO SOMETHING USEFUL! Of course this is just my opinion.

    By Blogger Orion the Hunter, at 12:14 p.m.  

  • Guys, I responded on my blog.

    Please post as promised.

    Here is the link

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    I have a Hurricane Katrina blog. It pretty much covers hurricane related stuff.

    Thank you - and keep up the thoughts!

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